Lena Dunham Is Prepared for Her Comeback

Lena Dunham is standing within the again backyard of her London house about to have a smoke. It’s the day Catherine Known as Birdy releases all over the world and the writer-director is celebrating with a “launch day deal with cigarette.” She asks if she’s OK to gentle up, talking over Zoom from her telephone. Provided that Catherine Known as Birdy is Dunham’s second function movie of 2022 and concludes a year-long comeback, this feels greater than a contact deserved.

Dunham is now a decade faraway from her directorial debut Tiny Furnishings and, after all, Ladies, the HBO drama that made her a family title. Time has been type to Ladies, its tack-sharp depiction of early twenties solipsism ageing impeccably, however Dunham was notably a lightning rod for criticism and controversy all through the 2010s. She took a hiatus after Ladies led to 2017 and, amid a collection of non-public and well being challenges, spent the time “planting seeds” for her second and third movies.

The consequence is a wonderful double invoice; Catherine Known as Birdy, tailored from Karen Cushman’s YA novel, a tender-hearted medieval comedy centred on a teenage woman compelled into marriage by her father, and Sharp Stick, an ambiguous, bold drama a couple of younger girl’s belated first sexual expertise. Each movies have a satisfying concord of their themes, properly complementing one another, and supply a crucial reminder that Lena Dunham is a consummate storyteller above all else.

As she pottered round her home, Dunham spoke to AnOther about Catherine Known as Birdy, her comeback, and the legacy of Ladies.

Patrick Sproull: Congratulations on each Catherine Known as Birdy and Sharp Stick, it’s been fairly a yr for you.

Lena Dunham: Thanks. My husband mentioned it’s like we now have two kids, and one didn’t do as nicely in class however they’re nonetheless a very cool particular person.

Patrick Sproull: They’re nearly like non-identical twins and, if we’re working with this analogy, you gave start to them at just about the identical time.

Lena Dunham: Sure, I did. They’re non-identical twins they usually have some issues in widespread and typically they’re reacting in opposition to one another.

Patrick Sproull: I first needed to ask you about Birdy herself. The place does she sit for you within the roster of Lena Dunham protagonists?

Lena Dunham: She’s one of many first characters that I ever even encountered as a result of I learn the ebook so younger. She was one of many first characters I felt like I deeply associated to. There have been so many books I liked – I liked the lead of The Secret Backyard, I liked the leads of Little Ladies, I liked the woman in A Little Princess, and I liked the characters of Judy Blume. However I felt like I used to be observing them and like I used to be emulating them and that they didn’t really feel related to me. Once I learn Catherine, Known as Birdy after I was ten for the primary time, I had that have that I believe is so superb that books and flicks can provide you the place you’re feeling like you’re experiencing this simulacrum of your self.

“My ardour for thorny or bratty or unlikeable or sophisticated girls, girls who behave badly, has most likely loads to do with having learn Catherine, Known as Birdy so younger” – Lena Dunham

Clearly, she will need to have actually formed the best way I take into consideration feminine characters as a result of I learn that ebook over and over and over. My ardour for thorny or bratty or unlikeable or sophisticated girls, girls who behave badly, has most likely loads to do with having learn the ebook so younger. In a method, regardless that she lives on this very totally different time, she’s just like the primordial character who I used to be all the time riffing off of and now have truly been in a position to convey to the display screen.

Patrick Sproull: Birdy is, clearly, Karen Cushman’s unique character so whenever you have been adapting the ebook, how did you make Birdy your personal?

Lena Dunham: I’ve all the time felt very related to her and I had all the time felt very related to the best way Karen had conceived her. I didn’t really feel like I needed to do an unlimited quantity with a view to really feel like I used to be referring to her or like she belonged to me. However that being mentioned, there was one thing concerning the technique of taking it from ebook to display screen the place, naturally, items of my expertise and internal life crept in. On this case it’s threefold, [Karen] writes a personality, then I develop my relationship with the character, after which Bella [Ramsey] is available in and develops her relationship with the character. So, it’s like these three individuals riffing on this one imaginary particular person and I like that. I like that facet of the method the place in every iteration one thing new occurred, and this character is form of handed down.

Patrick Sproull: I imagine this was your first time directing a function movie the place you didn’t have an performing position your self?

Lena Dunham: It was. I had a cameo in a fantasy sequence that was in the end minimize from the film and that wasn’t a giant half. There was one thing very nice about simply not bodily being in that world in any respect. I actually appreciated not being the central character in Sharp Stick and attending to exist on the periphery. I had a good time being in that film, however I realised what a pleasure it was to only utterly take away myself from that facet of it. As a lot as you need to have the ability to do all of it, eradicating your self from that facet simply allowed you to give attention to craft and on the opposite actors another way.

I’m positive that I’ll pop up in issues I direct sooner or later however I’m solely ever going to do it if I really feel like I’m the one one who can fulfil the position. On this, there have been tons of people that have been higher for each single position than I used to be. I might be the final candidate for mainly all of those roles.

Patrick Sproull: I assumed it was fascinating watching you place your personal spin on another person’s work. Are you able to see your self adapting different works sooner or later?

Lena Dunham: I believe there’s one thing about adaptation that basically frees you. What I like about fiction is which you can conceal your expertise within another person’s imagined expertise. What I like about adaptation is you’ll be able to conceal your feelings and your message and embed it in another person’s story, and also you’re on this actually fascinating dialogue with what they’ve created. So, I can see myself doing extra of it. I believe after I was youthful, I assumed adaptation was ‘nicely, can’t you give you your personal thought?’ and now I perceive. I took a poetry translation class in faculty and I used to be like, ‘Can I take this class? I don’t converse one other language’ they usually have been like, ‘Nicely, you’ll be able to translate it utilizing one thing like Google Translate’. Numerous what translators do isn’t only a word-for-word translation. Somebody who interprets – I don’t know, Rilke – isn’t simply doing it word-for-word, they’re looking for the spirit of what Rilke was attempting to say after which course of it via their lens. As soon as I understood that, I assumed it was a very fascinating factor to find out about poetry and now I perceive that’s additionally the case whenever you’re adapting a narrative to movie.

“If Ladies nonetheless makes you’re feeling seen in any method at that transitional second then that was the one aim” – Lena Dunham

Patrick Sproull: I learn an interview you probably did with Self-importance Honest lately the place you talked about that you simply don’t subscribe to the thought of ’clinging to at least one factor that you simply’ve made as your id’, which I assumed was fascinating as a result of the best way you’re written about and spoken about all the time connects you to Ladies. What are your ideas on frequently being linked to Ladies whenever you’re evolving as a creator and as an individual?

Lena Dunham: Nicely, it’s humorous as a result of the opposite day we have been doing an interview and somebody was asking me tons of Ladies-related questions. Bella was like, ‘does it ever annoy you to have to speak about Ladies a lot?’ and I used to be like, ‘I frequently really feel fortunate that folks care sufficient and that it continues to resonate for them sufficient that they need to discuss it.’ So, I’m all the time appreciative of that and I’m appreciative that I get to be linked to something that I’ve made as a result of that’s an expertise that I recognise is uncommon. Once I was 24, I assumed, ‘Oh, this occurs, you simply put one thing out and folks prefer it’ and I’ve had a profession for lengthy sufficient to know that that doesn’t all the time occur. However for me, it’s all the time odd, simply because it was such an expression of that point in my life and a lot has occurred, and my expertise of myself as an artist modified. I believe that is one thing I’ve discovered from having artist dad and mom; that regardless that you’ve made quite a lot of issues, you solely really feel as alive because the factor you’re making simply then.

Patrick Sproull: I do assume it’s the type of present that may simply proceed to resonate. I’m the identical age as Hannah at first of the collection and it undoubtedly hits otherwise.

Lena Dunham: Somebody informed me the opposite day that she liked Ladies and I used to be like, ‘How previous are you?’, and she or he was like ‘18!’ I used to be like, ‘Oh my god, so that you have been six after I wrote that pilot, which was not supposed for six-year-olds.’ However I like the thought as I all the time needed it to be one thing that lasted and that appealed to the expertise of being that age even when the expertise has modified. These characters weren’t coping with Instagram or TikTok in that first season, they weren’t coping with world we’re coping with now. But when it nonetheless makes you’re feeling seen in any method at that transitional second then that was the one aim.

Patrick Sproull: Are you able to see it as the kind of collection that would play in a distinct period? Is it one thing you can revisit in 20 years’ time, And Simply Like That fashion?

Lena Dunham: I hope that they’re characters that would stand the take a look at of time and folks would need to see them come again however I hope that they’re individuals who might evolve. There are such a lot of issues that need to occur, as we noticed with And Simply Like That, and I assumed it was actually ingenious how they rolled with all of the adjustments – adjustments to their our bodies, adjustments to the solid – however there’s so many issues that need to occur for a present to work. Each a kind of individuals needs to be in a spot of their life the place they need to do it, you must have a narrative to inform, you could have to have the ability to mirror on the time and it’s like catching lightning in a bottle.

It’s laborious for me to think about us seizing on that second the best way we did once we first did it. I might by no means need to do a model of it that felt prefer it was only for the sake of doing it. I by no means need to say by no means however on the similar time, a lot of it was about that second. We have been all beginning our careers, it was our first job, there was simply this delirious pleasure to attending to do it collectively, and so I wouldn’t need to come again with a severed model of it simply to do it.

Patrick Sproull: Due to the break you took after Ladies and with these movies popping out so shut collectively, do you’re feeling you’re coming into a brand new period of your profession? Are we within the ‘Lenaissance’?

Lena Dunham: I like the time period ‘Lenaissance’. My supervisor made me conscious of somebody saying ‘Lenaissance’ and I used to be like, ‘Nicely, that has a gorgeous ring to it’ and I’m grateful anybody’s ever mentioned. It’s humorous as a result of I’ve spent the final 5 years planting seeds, writing these scripts and determining what I need to do subsequent. Then this occurred to be the second during which all of it flowered shortly. I’ve all the time felt actually engaged with my artistic course of, however it’s solely now when individuals are attending to see it. It was a humorous factor that the films got here out collectively, however I assumed, ‘You already know, I’ve this chance and I’m going to grab it’. My aim after I made them shut collectively was that I hope they converse to one another. Despite the fact that they’re so totally different, they’re in dialogue with one another and, in a method, they’re in dialogue with Tiny Furnishings. It’s form of a trio of flicks which might be about totally different sorts of adolescences. My dad calls it my ‘girls’s coming of age trilogy’ and if they’ll really feel like they’re having a dialog with one another and have one thing to supply one another, that might be superb to me.

The factor that’s been most enjoyable about this yr when it comes to sharing issues publicly has simply been attending to reintroduce myself as a filmmaker and give attention to that facet of craft. For such a very long time my life was so dominated by Ladies that there was simply no area to make the rest. It’s rang a bell in my memory that placing issues into the world could be very gratifying as a result of the sorts of conversations I’ve gotten to have on account of it have been actually nice and have felt totally different than the sorts of conversations I had round Ladies. Generally the noise round Ladies was so loud that there couldn’t be conversations concerning the filmmaking or the performances or the concepts as a result of it was a lot dialog about dialog. So, getting to only sit down with you or another person and speak concerning the work is one thing that I don’t take as a right.

Catherine Known as Birdy is in UK cinemas now and streams on Amazon Prime Video from October 7.